wow that stuff is really good information..... I know I will be reading this thread like a million times b4 I get it right, but I understand whats going down. one thing, I did not know is that alpha channel. Wow that is really sweet. I was using that channel to great the nifty rock look from the clouds,diffrent clouds, lighting effects combo, and when I loaded it up in EQ it as all transparnt, well all the black was and it kicked ass, I guess most of the really nifty things come from mistakes