vbcypher

I was wondering if someone could point me to a couple places to get started on using EQ.

Let me restate. I've been "playing" EQ for about 2.5 years now. With all the new skinnable features, abilities to set viewports, etc, etc, etc, I want to start "using" EQ so I can set it up precisely how I want.

Depth of knowledge shouldn't be too much of a problem since i'm a software developer with about seven years experience, so it's not going to go over my head technically...I just cannot find the resources I'm looking for.

IOW (in other words)

I would love it find a site that would go into the details of the new skinnable features and how to set up your own skins. I've just started scouring this site and while I'm starting to make sense of it all I've not yet found a 'starter tutorial' to get me up and running.

I would also love to find a site that goes over some UI best practices and things like that. All I know about EQ is how I've set it up; where I've placed my windows, things like that. I'm sure that there are much better and more efficient ways of handling this and I would love to be clued in.

I would also love to find a site that maybe starts to explain the different files within the EverQuest directory and how to analyse/parse them. I'm sure this rubs real close to EULA from SoE so maybe you can offlist me a link on this one

...
I think SoE has come a long way since two years ago in terms of their interface, especially giving us the ability to tweak it as we see fit. I'm sure once I get a handle on things I'll have some great ideas for tweaks I want to do (seen a couple from screenshots on this site already) but I just don't know what I don't know.


Anyways, appreciate the help...anything you can throw my way would be appreciated.

R. Joe Reich

vbcypher

I see lots of people viewing the thread, but no one caring to share anything.

Didn't realize it was such a guarded secret. <shrug>

silencce

Probably isnt, but im not to sure if there is a tutorial for skinning EQ stuff, while there are many XML tutorials out there, what little i know doesnt go very far, basically i learned some of it using trial and error method, with a tiiiiiny bit of common sense i was able accomplish the small things i wanted to change.

if ya wanna know about xml i'd check www.webmonkey.com

issey

Seems like you and I are rare, sigh. I posted a few days back asking if there was a list of all the windows and all the data viewable. In hopes that making my own mix and match skin would be easier. No response so I'm plugging away on my own. There are some very nice tutorials on beginning xml that I've been working with. Maybe you can start the database of information you want. I'll contribute my 2 lists.

__________________
drael
who believes Issey Miyake should get to design special occassion (tradeskill) garb for our alts.

Sylphan

I've tried at various times to get people to even discuss UI best practices. There really isn't any interest, other than what is and isn't possible. Oh, and the list of EQTypes (be sure to get that).

For instance: You can't move buttons to different windows, but you can move text fields and gauges. Make sure the name of each control starts with a prefix (IW_ for the inventory window for instance) so that you can't end up with two controls with the same name. Read thru the EQUI_Animations file to find out how to do graphics, but don't actually modify that file. Generally anything you can add to EQUI_Animations can be put in other files and still work... and EQUI_Animations changes so often that it's a hassle to keep updating it if you've made changes. The autoequip area only works in the inventory window. Some windows allow tabs and some don't (there's a list around here somewhere).

But best practices like how big a text window should be, the 'pet attack' button should not be next to the 'pet go away' button, the destroy button shouldn't be right next to the autoequip button, group and spell windows should be close together so mouse users can click quickly, bright borders around the text window make it hard to read... all that stuff is mostly ignored. As a software developer you care about all that but 95 percent of the folks here are just amateurs, and beginners at that.

The best way to learn XML is to open up some of the XML files in your default directory and start reading. Make sure you use a text editor like Notepad or Wordpad; Internet Explorer is not a good way to view XML. After awhile you can figure out what each section means. Yes, you'd think a site like this might offer a tutorial or a textbook or documentation or something, but it's really not needed. Verant doesn't give us any documentation, and changes anything at all without notice anyway. XML is easy enough to figure out by reading the default files. The list of what windows there are is seen in EQUI.xml.

Hijiun

I beg to differ a little i think that IE is great for *VIEWING* xml i use it to view other files while i use note pad to edit. but everything else you said i agree with so rock on =)

just my 2 copper

__________________
"I am my own excuse"
Hijiun TwisterOfNature
Apprentice UI Maker

issey

Thanks for the info - never knew about the list in that file. I've been opening my files and browsing, lol.

Drakah

I just noticed this thread ... and it is quite upsetting

There is more information on this website about how to do the xml, where and what the "Tags" are, and more reponses to help everyone than I have seen in ages. I am shocked at the previous posts that there is supposedly "no help" when it comes to common information.

Let me just let you know that all the XML'ers, the moderators, admin, and many others have gone above and beyond telling everything they know to help and will continue to do so as best as they can. They created the FAQ section which tells you ALOT of what you need to know to get started, and otherwise written by Kudane. Also Remelio has his own Tutorial on his website, I suggest looking at that too. There are forum areas, broken down to what you need to find out. Informational posts that are Sticky for common usage, and alot more.

When EQ first came out with XML mods, I knew nothing about Xml. I viewed the Information area forum, read as many posts as I could, and tinkered alot in the Xml files with the thought "oooh what happens if I do THIS!". There is even a DOC file in the Default directory that you should had printed out just for reference. Siddle Widl and Siddle Fidl was also created to help do the mods.

Then there is that wonderful "Search" feature that is here. Yes it is extensive, there are alot of posts! But 9 times out of 10, the question you ask has most likely been answered, or otherwise, and you may get a similar/or correct answer to your question without too much fuss.

I took my time learning this stuff, did alot on my own. Read up on alot of posts, searched the web, searched here, de-picked Xml files from mods "ooh so THATS how they did it!", etc.

If you really want to learn and you are serious about it, all the information is in this forum. But if you are looking for a quick tutorial to do these files and expect it all to work, it just wont happen.

Let me just close in saying, I have never picked up an Xml Book, nor really plan to either. All the information I learned came from here. I use Notepad for the Xml, SiddleWidl for tweaking, and Adobe Photoshop for graphics. Its all I need and it works great.

Sorry if this post seems "ironfist", but when I see so many people devoting their own time to help others with mods/coding & creating mods, then to say they dont help, is quite unfair to them as well as others not taking the time to look for information, when it is already there, or just buried alittle. Just my 2cps.

In any case, I hope this helps!

__________________
Regards,

Drakah
shakahr.com
Remember...it is only a GAME

vbcypher

It's not so much on how to use XML that i need help with...I've plenty of experience using XML from my real life work (software developer)...I guess the real thing i was looking for was a just a tutorial on SIDL and whatnot.

What i'm going to do, and I guess what everyone else has done, is just download other people's finished work, look at what it "does" and then read the XML for the how-to's.

...

The second half of the question about the EQ best practices in game, playing strategies and whatnot (such as types of SOCIALs you should create, etc.) ... I'm still looking for a site that devulges secrets about that.

vbcypher

If you want to see the industry standard in XML editors...

www.xmlspy.com

When I work at a client I get them to buy a license or two of it for their people, but at $300 odd USD I haven't invested in a version for personal use.

I also use the Visual Studio.NET IDE to edit XML becuase it combines some of the best parts of IE and NOTEPAD

(the ability to view it "RAW" (notepad) as well as through an XSLT filter (IE))

vbcypher

Didn't want to quote all of this, as it was rather large.

I guess when I originally posted this I was just starting to look around and I didn't know what I was looking for and trying to find some direction.

I'm quite adept with XML so understanding how it works and how they organized their UI files wouldn't be a problem...it was just that there is a massive amount of files to work with, without very much documentation other than that one doc file they threw in there for you to print. (which I did )

So, as a developer, when I'm tackling a new problem or something I don't know the answer to I find someone who does and try to ask them for pointers. This site does have massive amounts of information regarding some the how-to's, but I didn't dig into them becuase I didn't want to get in over my head without understanding the fundementals...yet I didn't know what the fundementals were. So I posted.

Now, I'm hearing about Siddle Widl / Fidl etc...and I tracked down a link for it and i'm going to start playing with that for guideance. I even emailed the author and asked him if he wanted a helping hand with development of his tool to let me know (as I noticed it was in .NET and I'm a .NET developer and hey, why not)

So things are starting to pick up in the whole modd'ing bit altogether. I just have a bad, albeit usually effective, habit of asking first searching second when it comes to finding answers to things. Saves boatloads of potentially wasted time.

...
<takes a deep breath>
...

So...sorry if my post came across as "this site doesn't provide any help" I guess it just doesn't provide the help in the readily digested format I'm so accustomed to <grin>

OK, back to work...I'm off to download everyone's skins and start reading the files for examples.

issey

Drakah could you show me what you were quoting with "no help?" I cannot find that statement.
I have contributor under my name for a very good reason. I vote with my pocket book - and use this site way too often not to support it. Yet, despite all the great resources, faq's, posts and etc......I have yet to find the kind of discussion the original poster wanted.
I also got no response to my post about a list of windows. I am so non-computer geek that a spoon feeding tutorial is about my speed, lol. The list of windows and data we can move around in eq is quite necessary for me.

I take exception to your post and hope you were just having a bad day. Several months of surfing here, a naturally high intelligence but very minimal computer knowledge equals someone who still wishes for intro level faq, etc. I am slowly figuring things out. To my knowledge no one on this site makes cash from thier hard work so I do not expect to find anything other that what they wanted to produce.

Issey