Sylviania

i think this changes are good ... as long as they revamp uber bosses to be feasable with other tactics than mod rod fields.

I would like to welcome the monks in ranger's world, where you have to manage your agro to avoid getting killed.

I dislike the way they 'fixed' monks , as it makes them as dependant on loot as the others class are, where they should have been nearby as good naked as they are equiped. But I understand it was the only way to do for Verant, and i just hope it won't kill the average-stuffed monks

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Sylviania Delaforet
Ranger of Tunare , The Mother Of All
Seeker of Divinity
Rallos Zek Server

Earthscum

man, this is the deal:

People who complain about this tend to forget the other classes! Ok, so they nerfed the Mod Rod II... so you make mods and mods ii. Like someone else said earlier, if you're in a position where you need to use that many Mods, then you probably need healing yourself. (I play necro... I'm all to familiar with trading HP for mana!) As well, I'm not too proud to twitch when needed. I am always up for assisting in one way or another, whether it's twitching, dotting, or nuking... WHICH brings me to my nest point: MB

Yeah, they nerfed MB... so you get a couple necros buffed up with uber HP's and they drop a lifeburn assist. Umm, yeah... I said it... LIFEBURN! I think that there are some necros out there that would love to assist a wizzy like that )

About the monks: Well, I may start playing my SK again soon... Played Iksar SK's since the release of RoK, and decided I was tired of it... they didn't really have much of a roll, less hp and armor than warriors, blah blah blah.. so what does this have to do with monks getting the nerf bat? Just because I don't play my SK anymore doesn't mean I don't watch out for new SK happennings.

Ok, let me start over... monks are gonna be bitchin because they are mele'ing alot of damage and gaining alot of aggro and VI is nerfing them to take more damage.

SK now have a new line of spells that directly deals with this issue! SK are (supposed to be) the masters of aggro. I hardly ever had a caster die in a group that I was in! THIS is why I may play my SK again. The new SK spells include varying degrees of aggro enhancement, plus the self buffs. This means that a SK can can basically put a GREAT BIG MIDDLE FINGER ON THE CHEST OF EVERY WARRIOR OR TANK IN THE GROUP! Ok, if a tanking group consists of 2warriors, 2monks, and say 2SK's, I really don't think the monks are gonna have much aggro. Really...

Oh yeah... not to start a fight, but my SK can (and could before) outtaunt any pally in norrath. Our spells are made just for that (still cracks me up to see a L45 SK using Disease cloud... even though I know it's simply for the taunt factor!). Wanna see a mob turn on you quick? Stand right next to it and light off your Harm Touch right after taunting it... only casters I have main problem with is Wizzies, but this new line of spells should help with that.

kimagure

I hate to tell you this, but SK aggro spells have been nerfed big time since you last played your iksar sk... I'd suggest you check out shadowknight.org forums or something. The new SK aggro spells are not even close to what Disease Cloud use to do before the resist changes. In fact, I doubt many SK use it for aggro anymore. Paladins with their stun now are more likely to get aggro if you're comparing who is going to get whipback-type aggro from a mob.

As for the new SK spells, there isnt anything that will give you hate like DC once did. Sure the terror line says it gives 400 points of hate or whatever, but in the grand scheme of things, 400 points doesnt mean jack apparently. SK have said they have been chain casting it as well as having the 8% hate modifying buff up and still not getting aggro when they need to pull a mob off a group member.

Ninjaman

as a soloing lvl 50 monk, verant is about to shaft me....it's hard enough as it is to solo at 50

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Linale

Since when are monks considered a solo class???

KarecK

Well, personaly, i play a Monk and a Shadowknight. As for the Monk defense being nerfed, that hits home rather hard, even being under the 14 pound weight limit and with halfway decent armor<not to teribly twinked>, i still get owned by more mobs in the 35 to 40 range even with Mend and all offenseive capability if i screw up, i take almost as much dmg as a cleric does fighting said mobs, at least the cleric has the option to heal themself, i can heal myself once every few minutes. So the lowering of the defensive abilitys of a monk is going to hurt an otherwise fun class to play. As for the Cleric CH nerf. i cant truly comment on that because i do not play a cleric, but from a Sk point of view, 7500hp is 3k less hp then i would otherwise have been healed. Granted, ive never even seen a time where i had more than about 3900hp with my sk, so its hard for me to comment on that. The Mage Mod rod2 spell i cant comment on, due to not having much experience with it, nor can i comment on the Wizard MB change, due to not having exp, and for those druids out there who think its fun to quad kite, you have obviously never gone to a zone to try and solo only to have a druid take the mob your fighting and add it to his set of mobs saying hey, i can kite, its fair.

kagetan

Monks tend to outdamage rogues, who are fairly decent in melee damage, in the melee category, have pretty good defense and evasive capabilities, which enables them to solo.. and they can feign death, thereby dramatically reducing their chances of dying. Long overdue for a nerf, if you ask me.

Melosa

The thing that truly disappoints me is that instead of "fixing" a problem, it seems as if they are taking away from many classes. Some friends and I were discussing this, and some of the ideas that were tossed out were instead of nerfing monks, why not add a little bit more versatility to the warriors? For example, give them other "abilities" (perhaps in AAXP) to use. Like Knockdown, Called Shot (yes, we stole these ideas from NWN). Or maybe "bonus" feats when using a 2-hander, not just bash. Maybe even tossing in a higher chance for a stun if a high level warrior opts to use a sword and shield style of play. Obviously, we didn't come up with detailed ideas of these, but something like this would not detract from other classes, at least not that any of us could see. It would add more variety to the tanks, and then the rest of the classes could continue doing their jobs like they always have been.

As for trying to get rid of the CHeal rotation, I can't see this doing it. Especially considering the recent changes given to druid and shaman heals. Instead of getting rid of the rotation on the uber raids, they'll just have to add in a druid or shaman to help with the heals. Of course, that's just my opinion.

As to the Manaburn, having never played a wizard, I can't really say much. Though my guess is that this came about because a small number of folks "took advantage" and some others complained. On the other hand, I've watched a group of 6 take down those dragons, why not a group of 6 wizards?

On the ModRods, to me, it's a toss up. I see advantages and disadvantages in the change, and in the current situation.

But overall, I guess we just have to wait and see. Oh, and keep our fingers crossed that it's not as bad as we think it's going to be.

Gniss Fleshmend

The main reason they are not buffing other classes to compensate is because that is a spiral of death, commonly refered to as Mudflation.

They're trying to take a long view on keeping the game healthy and running for as long as possible, because it's a garenteed moneymaker, whereas anything new is in investment, with concurrent risks.


They probably sat down, and looked at these problems, and said something to the effect of: "well, either we can take these four classes down a couple of notches and retune part of the game, then fix the bards we broke doing this, or buff the other 11 classes up higher, retune the entire game, and THEN fix the bards we broke doing this. Hmmm... option one looks like the better deal."

Earthscum

HAHAHA!!! They ARE gonna break the bards again, aren't they? :-)

Sry... playing a bard must be frustrating... at least you have someone on the inside looking out for ya :-)

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Death to the Banannas!
Iksar vs. Bananna

Spiritwalker

<Hands out a box of Kleanex> It's about time druids got a break that would allow them to be more desired in groups at higher levels. We been forced to quad kite and use our DRUID abilities since the game first started, so now that we get a break you pure casters/melee start whining about us kiting. If we weren't so undesirable in groups all along we wouldn't need to kite and solo so much.

Get off my trees.

Spiritwalker Blackfoot

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Spiritwalker Blackfoot
Voyagers of Xegony
Amazons of Xegony

pheonixheart

ooooooooooo goody!!! Monks are already gear dependent to stay alive seeing as they tend to draw tooo much damned agro... and the gear has to be really light weight because of the ac penalty... So now we get to take more dmg than we already do on top of eating agro and being responsible for using i'd estimate easily more than half the cleric's mana in a FULL group!!! WTF are they thinking? And wtf are they talking about the all/all being Monk loot ... Um hello? our weight penalty already sucks up our AC as is... i'd gotten so used to NOT looting anything but friggin "a salil's writ pg. 60" kind of thing for so long that when i started my bard (which i now love) that i completely forgot to bother looting at all for the first 20 lvls for crying out loud.... obviously they haven't actually bothered to play the class in a real live game atmosphere now have they?

To the person who says that monks outdamage rogues generally: you must not be playing w/very effective rogues, (and must not have played a monk) =P cause they are about the only class who i ever have to worry about taking agro off me (aside from the occasional early nuking wizza) ROFLMFAO!!! HAHAHAHA!

Anyhow sheesh we already only can use mend (woohoo 1/4 health back every 6 mins) ok, yes can be a lifesaver in a fight long enough to give you some time to FD, but as hard as high end mobs hit, they can take out your mend in only ONE round of attack... And everyone wants monks to be pullers cause they're so great at it... yeah we are hunkey dorey pullers when buffed to the nines and w/great gear... but when you get into the really hard hitting mobs you end up almost half down in health before you get back to yer group esp if you have to pull any distance! And don't even get me started on mage pets... at lvl 20 i grouped w/a couple mage friends, and their damn pets were outdamaging me (no i didn't have decent weaps at that time.. polished steel ulak and fist - i'm nowhere near twinked. They don't do that anymore because now i have a FBSS and better gear, but the point is, is that at no time should a blue con pet be able to outdamage a monk at any time in the monk's life regardless of gear! And if monks are supposed to be so great at dealing dmg then make them better... i mean sheesh my monk's fists are 11/32 dmg.... that's wonderful, but please... do you know ANY other melee class that would dare sport an 11/32 weapon at lvl 42? hrmmmmm, do ya???? no... they've got bigger dmg weaps w/ MUCH faster delay times... the only extra cool thing is that we do have dual weild and double attack yeah, but other classes have that too... Jeez we already have to rely on FD to stay alive as it is... and by the time our mend pops again or we regen to full health, the mob we were fighting is COMPLETELY healed! we already agro like crazy so wtgdf are they thinking INCREASING how much dmg we take? And whoever asked "since when is a monk a soloable class?" is right... we really aren't, and now that we're gonna be eating all that much more of the cleric's mana cause they haven't fixed the f'ing agro issue but are making us take MORE dmg w/o giving us more hp's to compensate for it, is that little bit of extra dmg we can do really gonna be wanted in a group? naw go w/the warrior he has a haste item and can take the hits better it will save mana for when we get too many adds if i dun have to keep healin the damn monk is what the clerics are gonna be reasoning... and they'll be right too! /rolls eyes at Verant...

Sheesh Verant needs to actually play their own friggin game specifically the classes they propose to change before they start releasing these so called "fixes" jeez the fact that my monk dies despite the special abilities way to often is why i quit playing her to begin with... i'm not twinked at all, and the fact that i have to be just to compete w/others of my same lvl and class is already ridiculous. If they are going to do that, then they should at least make us more effective w/o having to have ubergear... We already get piddly amounts of hp's compared to other melees, even hybrids! and now we are going to take more damage too? making us even MORE gear dependent????? THANK YOU VERANT! Wow what a great job!

Also: um, we've ALWAYS had to manage our aggro to avoid getting killed even w/our special abilities, and we don't get to cast sow on ourselves to run away, and we don't get to wear really good ac items because of the weight issue or we lose more ac than we gain w/it, we can't wear chainmail, we cant weild awesome swords, our "uber" items cost way more than comparable 1hs items, we HAVE to have jboots or buy sow potions or rely on other classes to buff us to make us able to run away, so if FD fails, or a caster started casting before we hit FD, we are really screwed, and believe me timing is EVERYTHING w/FD! and lag will kill a monk who has less than 2 bubs of health in no time flat because it's impossible to ensure you have the right timing w/FD when you are lagging badly, and often times clerics and other healer types tend to group monks w/other melees and don't even think about healing untill they see it's down to 2 bubs of health, and to a monk who has so few hp's compared to the other melee classes, this can mean (and has often meant) death... - and, no offense but every single ranger i have EVER grouped with made a much better TANK than me... not damage dealer, but tank. FD is not infallible, even at mastery lvls... while it rarely fails higher up, mobs also do get a chance to "disbelieve" it as well as the whole trying to time it w/casters... and if you're in a fight w/lots of adds, and one has already begun their attack when you FD, it knocks you out of fd while still laying on your ass, so even though it may have worked on the other mobs, the fact you were still hit lets the mobs know you're faking, and they start whomping on ya again... So i dun wanna hear word one about welcome to aggro management and ranger world =P heh

okies /rant off

for the Manaburn: erm,... think theyre nerfing it too much, but it did need to be done a little bit...

as for the rod? no clue no comment hehe =P

quikain

...ok ...really REALLY not happy about any of these changes... but since i play a monk/cleric definatly miffed about rods .. but monk ac! give me a break! that is ridiculous. but i suppose nothing can b done, all i have to say is honestly... why.... i mean nothing has been done to prevent me from drawing agro and now i will get hit harder and more often draning more clr/dru mana, also pulling high end mobs id goin to b a bitch now ... plz tell me this makes sence to somone. its like they are trying to make the game as unplayable as possable and still b playable .. if u get what i mean. as if pure meles werent messed up enough by the recent resists changes... oh im done .. feel a little better thx for ur time reading my rant

quikain

monks are "suposed" to be in the top rung of solo classes in the high end game and we are suposed to do sick damage ... its in the class discrption ..